No charges in Tamir Rice case

[Adam]

Tamir Rice decision: No indictments of Cleveland police officers

CLEVELAND, Ohio — A Cuyahoga County grand jury on Monday elected not to bring criminal charges against the two Cleveland police officers involved in last year's fatal shooting of 12-year-old Tamir Rice.

The decision not to indict officers Timothy Loehmann and Frank Garmback brings to an end a months-long criminal investigation into the high-profile shooting.

Monday's decision comes more than 13 months after the shooting, which catapulted Cleveland into the national debate about police use of force.

Cuyahoga County Prosecutor Timothy J. McGinty, whose oversight of the grand jury process drew criticism, called the shooting "a perfect storm of human error" while announcing the grand jury's decision at a press conference.

The grand jury heard evidence over nearly three months, including conflicting reports written by five experts in police use of force, statements read by Loehmann and Garmback and testimony from some of Tamir's relatives who arrived within minutes at the scene of the shooting.

In their statements, the officers each wrote that they saw Tamir pulling what they thought was a real gun out of his waistband before Loehmann shot the boy from close range.

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Another sad case of death by stupid. This is the right call. They ought to be indicting the mother for reckless endangerment for willfully letting Tamir run around with that gun threatening people.

[Billy Jingo]

Ohio is open carry.

[scott]

Ohio is open carry.

But not open brandishing. Also not for kids.

[Billy Jingo]

But not open brandishing. Also not for kids.

So anyone holding a weapon in their hand is subject to deadly force? Or is it just kids?

[Lady Marva]

Will there be riots?

[scott]

So anyone holding a weapon in their hand is subject to deadly force? Or is it just kids?

Anyone brandishing a weapon, including kids.

[Frostbit]

Anyone brandishing a weapon, including kids.

Obviously we need stiffer laws for toy guns.

[Tom Servo]

I disagree, this was not the right call. He was not "brandishing" unless "reaching for a fake gun" somehow fits that description. Also, it was not a real gun, but an Airsoft with the orange safety tip removed.

I do agree that his mother should be prosecuted for endangerment, though.

[scott]

I disagree, this was not the right call. He was not "brandishing" unless "reaching for a fake gun" somehow fits that description. Also, it was not a real gun, but an Airsoft with the orange safety tip removed.

I do agree that his mother should be prosecuted for endangerment, though.

Did you see the whole video?

[Adam]

I disagree, this was not the right call. He was not "brandishing" unless "reaching for a fake gun" somehow fits that description.

It does.

Also, it was not a real gun, but an Airsoft with the orange safety tip removed.

Which one is real?







Too late. You already died trying to decide.

[Tom Servo]

Too late. You already died trying to decide.

To answer Frostbit's question first, all I've seen of the video is of the boy pointing the gun at nobody, captured on security camera, and then later the police pulling up and shooting him as he reaches for his waistband. At no time did it appear he pulled the gun from his waistband and showed it to the cops.

At no time did the cops yell at him to put his hands up. They just screech up and start shooting. Even if they saw part of the gun in his shorts, it wasn't in his hand and it wasn't pointed at the cops. They over-reacted, pure and simple.

Look, I've watched enough COPS on TV (25 years and counting) and seen plenty of kids and young adults with weapons on their bodies, and not once did anyone get shot first before getting a hands up command or some other warning. There's a protocol to follow and these cops did not do it. They should be in jail for life.

[scott]

To answer Frostbit's question first, all I've seen of the video is of the boy pointing the gun at nobody, captured on security camera, and then later the police pulling up and shooting him as he reaches for his waistband. At no time did it appear he pulled the gun from his waistband and showed it to the cops.

At no time did the cops yell at him to put his hands up. They just screech up and start shooting. Even if they saw part of the gun in his shorts, it wasn't in his hand and it wasn't pointed at the cops. They over-reacted, pure and simple.

Look, I've watched enough COPS on TV (25 years and counting) and seen plenty of kids and young adults with weapons on their bodies, and not once did anyone get shot first before getting a hands up command or some other warning. There's a protocol to follow and these cops did not do it. They should be in jail for life.

So you saw the video of the kid aiming his gun. You didn't see who he was aiming at, but those people were the ones who called the police. When they showed up he reached for the gun in his waistband before they could even get out of the car. They shot him.

Protocol was followed, even the grand jury thinks so.

Here's what the Police were told:

[phillygirl]

It's a shame. A damn shame. No reason in the world for that kid to be dead, except for his actions. I'm sure the police wish they could redo that day, that moment. The dispatcher should have given them more information, but as set forth above, while trying to figure out why someone is reaching for a gun in his waistband, the officer could be the one that was dead.

[Adam]

To answer Frostbit's question first, all I've seen of the video is of the boy pointing the gun at nobody, captured on security camera, and then later the police pulling up and shooting him as he reaches for his waistband. At no time did it appear he pulled the gun from his waistband and showed it to the cops.

There's your Goddamn problem, right there: you actually think that cops have to stand there and wait to actually get shot before they can defend themselves.

Newsflash: cops have absolutely no obligation to stand there and take bullets just to satisfy your silly emotionalism.

At no time did the cops yell at him to put his hands up.

And you know this how?

They just screech up and start shooting. Even if they saw part of the gun in his shorts, it wasn't in his hand and it wasn't pointed at the cops. They over-reacted, pure and simple.

They reacted exactly how they should have: they shot someone who was an apparent threat to them and others.

Look, I've watched enough COPS on TV (25 years and counting) and seen plenty of kids and young adults with weapons on their bodies, and not once did anyone get shot first before getting a hands up command or some other warning. There's a protocol to follow and these cops did not do it. They should be in jail for life.

Sooooo.....

You've based your ridiculous, unrealistic emotionalism on .... a TV show.




I've watched enough Star Trek: The Next Generation to know that every Klingon with a bat'leth will say that they will kill you where you stand for insulting their honor, but not once did Worf ever actually slice someone in half.

Good fucking grief. Get real.

[Celeste Chalfonte]

I disagree, this was not the right call. He was not "brandishing" unless "reaching for a fake gun" somehow fits that description. Also, it was not a real gun, but an Airsoft with the orange safety tip removed.

I do agree that his mother should be prosecuted for endangerment, though.

Have you ever done a shoot/don't shoot simulation? If someone goes to his waistband and you see what looks like a gun there, you better damn well shoot, because you only have seconds before he shoots YOU, if it's a real gun.

I have a pellet gun. It looks exactly like my instructor's .40 caliber pistol until you get really close. If you get that close and you guessed wrong, BANG! you're dead.

What kind of friggin' idiot goes for a gun of any kind when confronted by cops? It's suicide, and anybody with 2 brain cells knows it.

I'm no cheerleader for cops. Way too many of them power-trip and abuse the badge. But when I was a commie hippie anti-war demonstrator, if the cops said "freeze," smart people fuckin' FROZE. When being confronted by a cop, smart people put the hands on their heads and say, "Yes, officer, what can I do for you?" They don't reach for a gun or anything that might be mistaken for one.