"Climate Change is real."

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  • Celeste Chalfonte
    apostate
    • Saturday, October 5, 2013
    • 27897

    #1

    "Climate Change is real."

    It's in the archeological finds that inform our natural history and science. There were seas where there is now desert. There were ice ages. In living systems, stasis = death, so of course there has been change, and will be. Did humans cause it? Not significantly more than any other life form, now extant or in the past, would be my guess, but I'm pretty sure the question is also mostly irrelevant.

    I found this piece on the topic interesting and refreshingly different from the usual gloom and doom. Bold is mine.

    The Brookings Institution reported in September 2018 that humanity had reached a stunning milestone: “For the first time since agriculture-based civilization began 10,000 years ago, the majority of humankind is no longer poor or vulnerable to falling into poverty.” More than half of the world’s population — some 3.8 billion people — now earned enough to be considered “middle class” or “rich.”

    Think about what that means: For most of what Ronald Reagan famously called mankind’s “long climb from the swamp to the stars” the norm for most people had been abject poverty. Now, the norm is prosperity.

    What made this transformation possible? The collapse of the Soviet empire, the worldwide turn away from socialism, and the U.S.-led global expansion of free trade and free enterprise — fueled by access to cheap, reliable sources of energy — all have lifted people across the world out of poverty.

    We should be doing everything possible to accelerate this progress, so millions more can join the ranks of the middle-class majority. Instead, climate activists are advocating policies that would deny poor nations access to inexpensive, abundant fossil fuels they need to develop their economies — which would ultimately leave tens of millions of people in poverty and more vulnerable to climate-induced disasters.

    To make up for lost economic growth, activists are pushing government-to-government wealth transfer payments. First came a proposed $100 billion-a-year fund that rich countries agreed to a decade ago to pay poor countries to reduce emissions and forgo fossil fuels. Now, at the U.N. Climate Change Conference in Egypt, known as COP27, wealthy nations have agreed to pay poor nations reparations for costs of natural disasters supposedly caused by the industrialized world’s use of fossil fuels.

    This is insanity. The reason poor nations suffer disproportionate damage from natural disasters is poverty. When Hurricane Ian hit Florida in September, it caused lots of damage but relatively few deaths. Power was restored and bridges swiftly rebuilt. By contrast, a similar storm hitting poor countries could kill thousands and disrupt the economy for years because better infrastructure does more to save lives than cutting emissions.

    <snip>

    The fact is, nations with higher GDP enjoy lower mortality, higher standards of living and greater resilience. Their citizens live in sturdy homes with middle-class luxuries such as air conditioning and central heat that protect them from temperature-related deaths. They have access to better health care and food security, which does more to fight malnutrition than reducing carbon emissions. And their societies can afford advanced flood-control and disaster warning systems, such as the European Flood Awareness System. There is a reason, as global poverty has dramatically declined, climate-related deaths from floods, fires, storms, droughts and extreme temperatures have plummeted.

    Climate change is real. But forcing developing countries to abandon fossil fuels — and denying tens of millions the opportunity to join the nascent global middle class — will cost more lives. And no amount of reparations could ever make up for that.​
    Washington Post - should be a paywall-free link for more.
    "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)
  • 80zephyr
    Senior Member
    • Saturday, January 3, 2015
    • 19074

    #2
    If you pay a country to not use fossil fuels, how do they live?

    Mark
    Race Card: A tool of the intellectually weak and lazy when they cannot counter a logical argument or factual data.

    "Liberals have to stop insisting that the world is what they want it to be instead of the way it is." - Bill Maher

    Political correctness is ideological fascism. It’s the antithesis of freedom. Dr. Piper

    Gender is not a "Social Construct", it is an outgrowth of biological reality.

    Comment

    • Newman
      Behind the Iron Curtain
      • Friday, November 1, 2013
      • 25814

      #3
      Originally posted by 80zephyr View Post
      If you pay a country to not use fossil fuels, how do they live?

      Mark
      I suspect the goal is to reduce the population.

      "Weed the garden," Margaret Sanger would say.
      • "I'm a hell of a lot smarter than most of you guys." — Joe Biden, at Jesse Jackson's funeral, March 2026.​
      • "That's all I do in my life. I make deals. I'm really good at it." — President Donald Trump, Oct. 13, 2025.
      • “Inside every progressive is a totalitarian screaming to get out,” — David Horowitz.
      • "We [Democrats] are all willing to work with anyone who is serious about doing the work of censoring the American people, and advancing progress."​ — Ayanna Pressley, explaining progressives.
      • ​​"Florida is where Woke goes to die." — Ron DeSantis.
      • "No one is above the law, and everyone has the right to a trial to prove innocence." — Nancy Pelosi, explaining Lawfare.
      • “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”​— Ben Franklin, who got it right.
      • "The way I see it, there's always, c'mon, there's always money. It's there." — Elizabeth Warren, explaining socialism.
      • "The interesting thing about the Green New Deal is it wasn't originally a climate thing at all.... We really think of it as a how-do-you-change-the-entire-economy thing." — Saikat Chakrabarti, then AOC's Chief of Staff.

      Comment

      • Frostbit
        But only once
        • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
        • 22330

        #4
        Excellent book on the topic

        Screen Shot 2022-11-25 at 2.21.34 PM.png
        If it pays, it stays

        Comment

        • Adam
          The way to a woman's heart is through her taste buds.
          • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
          • 16885

          #5
          "Climate Change is real."

          ​But not in the way that it's portrayed. Yes, the climate is ever-changing, and always has been. But the portrayal of this has been bastardized beyond belief. And they're wrong every time with their predictions. I can't even count how many times in the last 40-50 years that if we don't stop doing X, then the world is going to end. They've decided to center on fossil fuels, I guess because it's a convenient target. So now we have coal-powered cars and people are going to be freezing to death this winter in Europe. This is just asinine.

          Every year, there's some forest fire somewhere in California or close by in the far west of the country, and these hucksters come running out to shout "See?!?! Global warming is real!." (of course, in reality, those fires happened because of poor forest management that was demanded by ... global warming activists). Then, a few months later, when there are record low temperatures, sane people say "well, where's that global warming when they have five feet of snow in Buffalo?" and the immediate retort is "weather isn't climate, you big dummy." So, which is it? "Well, when it's cold, it's 'climate change,' and when it's hot, it's 'global warming.'"

          What a total cock-up. You have to either pick one, or else admit that none of this was caused by SUVs. Can't have it both ways. And these characters have the nerve to claim that "carbon dioxide is pollution," to which I respond "well, then stop exhaling." When I say that, they say "well, me exhaling is 'good carbon dioxide.'" What utter bullshit. It's a chemical compound: either it's good or it's bad, but if you're convinced that it's bad and you're literally producing it with every breath, then if you truly believe what you say, you'll stop producing it. Blank stares and utter silence in response.

          Let's start addressing real pollution instead of imaginary "carbon pollution." If we're going to bulldoze billions of dollars into third-world countries to "control pollution," then let's actually do that: get scrubbers onto coal plants in India and China and whatnot, get people in Asian countries to stop bulldozing many tons of plastic (and other) waste into the Pacific, get this country onto as much nuclear power as possible, then do the same with other countries (with appropriate checks to make sure they can't weaponize it). THEN we can worry about SUVs polluting the atmosphere.
          It's been ten years since that lonely day I left you
          In the morning rain, smoking gun in hand
          Ten lonely years but how my heart, it still remembers
          Pray for me, momma, I'm a gypsy now

          Comment

          • scott
            Go-to Guru
            • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
            • 15799

            #6
            Originally posted by Celeste Chalfonte View Post
            It's in the archeological finds that inform our natural history and science. There were seas where there is now desert. There were ice ages. In living systems, stasis = death, so of course there has been change, and will be. Did humans cause it? Not significantly more than any other life form, now extant or in the past, would be my guess, but I'm pretty sure the question is also mostly irrelevant.

            I found this piece on the topic interesting and refreshingly different from the usual gloom and doom. Bold is mine.



            Washington Post - should be a paywall-free link for more.
            Agreed, 100%
            "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
            -John Locke

            "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
            -Newman

            "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
            -Newman

            Comment

            • 80zephyr
              Senior Member
              • Saturday, January 3, 2015
              • 19074

              #7
              image.png​
              Race Card: A tool of the intellectually weak and lazy when they cannot counter a logical argument or factual data.

              "Liberals have to stop insisting that the world is what they want it to be instead of the way it is." - Bill Maher

              Political correctness is ideological fascism. It’s the antithesis of freedom. Dr. Piper

              Gender is not a "Social Construct", it is an outgrowth of biological reality.

              Comment

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