What do we get for our taxes?

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  • Celeste Chalfonte
    apostate
    • Saturday, October 5, 2013
    • 27897

    #1

    What do we get for our taxes?

    April is the month when state and local governments expect us to pay for the privilege of being Californians. April 10 is the deadline for paying semi-annual property taxes without penalty, and April 15 is the deadline for filing federal and state income tax returns.

    It is, therefore, an appropriate time for weighing whether the taxes we Californians pay — not only those on property and income, but throughout the year on sales and fuel — buy satisfactory levels of service.

    The Washington-based Tax Foundation, in a new report, pegs Californians’ state and local tax burden at 13.5% of personal income, or $10,167 a person — fifth highest in the nation. That’s roughly $400 billion in taxes that those we elect to office have to spend each year.

    Whether we consider our return on that investment to be adequate is probably as individual as our fingerprints. But WalletHub, a website that researches personal finance issues, recently attempted to calculate it objectively. California gets the nation’s second lowest score, eclipsed only by New Mexico. New Hampshire scored the best, followed by Florida.

    WalletHub’s research team calculated tax revenue per adult for each state and compared it to five categories of government services: education, health, public safety, economy and infrastructure combined with pollution.

    California’s services were rated as mediocre, 37th overall, with low scores for public safety, economy, infrastructure and pollution. However, the state’s high level of taxation, mirroring the Tax Foundation’s data, sank its return on investment to near the bottom.

    <snip>
    Despite the tax load, the state is dealing with multibillion-dollar budget deficits, due to overspending its revenues, and legislators are being pressed to cover the shortfalls with new corporate taxes.

    <snip>

    High taxes should bring us smooth roads, effective police and fire services, high levels of education, reliable water supplies and other efficient returns on our investment, which residents of New Hampshire and Florida apparently enjoy.​​
    LINK

    CalMatters is not a hate-California, hate-Newsom website; it runs neutral-to-slightly-liberal.

    When we returned to CA in 2012 from 16 years living in Florida, I was utterly shocked by how bad the roads had gotten (and still are). Everyone knows about the schools, which were once, long ago, some of the best in the country. There is a severe shortage of medical and veterinary personnel, including pharmacists; since there is no shortage of people willing and able to pay for these services, I can only conclude that people with medical training are moving out of state. Fortunately for us, Kaiser just expanded into Monterey County, and they somehow manage to keep their facilities well-staffed, but even so, we have to go to San Jose for some specialty care.

    I love California. I love being able to walk to the ocean. I love being able to have the windows and doors open 10 months of the year, and not deal with any bugs. I love hearing 4 or 5 different languages spoken during the course of a trip to Safeway or an hour at the beach. I love that I can drive 4 hours or less and go through at least 3 different climates - not weather, climates. I don't love having a state government that thinks money magically appears because they commit to spending it.


    "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)
  • Michele
    Senior Member
    • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
    • 13964

    #2
    California is one of the most beautiful states I have been to.
    May we raise children who love the unloved things - the dandelion, the worm, the spiderlings.
    Children who sense the rose needs the thorn and run into rainswept days the same way they turn towards the sun...
    And when they're grown and someone has to speak for those who have no voice,
    may they draw upon that wilder bond, those days of tending tender things and be the one.

    Comment

    • Frostbit
      But only once
      • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
      • 22330

      #3
      Originally posted by Michele View Post
      California is one of the most beautiful states I have been to.
      Been to Alaska much?
      If it pays, it stays

      Comment

      • Michele
        Senior Member
        • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
        • 13964

        #4
        Originally posted by Frostbit View Post

        Been to Alaska much?
        Twice and it's a very beautiful state, too!

        Actually, I can't imagine there's a state in this country that doesn't have some bragging rights to the beauty of their land.
        May we raise children who love the unloved things - the dandelion, the worm, the spiderlings.
        Children who sense the rose needs the thorn and run into rainswept days the same way they turn towards the sun...
        And when they're grown and someone has to speak for those who have no voice,
        may they draw upon that wilder bond, those days of tending tender things and be the one.

        Comment

        • Celeste Chalfonte
          apostate
          • Saturday, October 5, 2013
          • 27897

          #5
          Originally posted by Michele View Post

          Twice and it's a very beautiful state, too!

          Actually, I can't imagine there's a state in this country that doesn't have some bragging rights to the beauty of their land.
          True. Parts of Texas are just barren, but other parts are beautiful, likewise Oklahoma. Don't want to live in Louisiana, with the heat, humidity and bugs, but it's gorgeous. New Mexico and Arizona have some beautiful landscapes, even though I would have a hard time living anywhere away from the ocean. My home state, Maryland, is too cold most of the year and too hot most of the rest, but those 4 to 6 weeks in the spring and fall are unbeatable. A September visit to Ocean City would nearly carry me through to spring. Nearly.
          "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)

          Comment

          • phillygirl
            Not superior, just kind
            • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
            • 19840

            #6
            Originally posted by Celeste Chalfonte View Post

            True. Parts of Texas are just barren, but other parts are beautiful, likewise Oklahoma. Don't want to live in Louisiana, with the heat, humidity and bugs, but it's gorgeous. New Mexico and Arizona have some beautiful landscapes, even though I would have a hard time living anywhere away from the ocean. My home state, Maryland, is too cold most of the year and too hot most of the rest, but those 4 to 6 weeks in the spring and fall are unbeatable. A September visit to Ocean City would nearly carry me through to spring. Nearly.
            I find the Chesapeake Bay to be one of the most beautiful environs there is. Many visitors have said as much.. Even my only tiny plot, not on the Bay, but on a small river, gives some of the most beautiful sunsets around. I love that the Bay still has trees, and beach, etc.

            But I think Michele is right. There is probably not a state in the Union that doesn't have something to brag about.

            I follow someone on Facebook (Josh from England). He has traveled a fair amount of the U.S. and is probably its biggest cheerleader. He commented that it was unfair to criticize Americans because they haven't traveled abroad much...he pointed out that the vastness of our country and the diversity of what can be found in the U.S. would keep anyone busy and satisfied in terms of travel. I think he's right. I've never been that into the snobbery of some who travel abroad. Don't get me wrong, it's wonderful to see and experience other cultures. But I also believe our country has some amazing things to see in its own right (especially, but not exclusively, if traveling to the national parks).
            Not where I breathe, but where I love, I live...
            Robert Southwell, S.J.

            Comment

            • Celeste Chalfonte
              apostate
              • Saturday, October 5, 2013
              • 27897

              #7
              Originally posted by phillygirl View Post

              I find the Chesapeake Bay to be one of the most beautiful environs there is. Many visitors have said as much.. Even my only tiny plot, not on the Bay, but on a small river, gives some of the most beautiful sunsets around. I love that the Bay still has trees, and beach, etc.

              But I think Michele is right. There is probably not a state in the Union that doesn't have something to brag about.

              I follow someone on Facebook (Josh from England). He has traveled a fair amount of the U.S. and is probably its biggest cheerleader. He commented that it was unfair to criticize Americans because they haven't traveled abroad much...he pointed out that the vastness of our country and the diversity of what can be found in the U.S. would keep anyone busy and satisfied in terms of travel. I think he's right. I've never been that into the snobbery of some who travel abroad. Don't get me wrong, it's wonderful to see and experience other cultures. But I also believe our country has some amazing things to see in its own right (especially, but not exclusively, if traveling to the national parks).
              HRH often quotes someone whose name I can't recall, "In the UK, 100 miles is a long way. In the US, 100 years is a long time." I'm not all that into England, but the fact that there are buildings in use to day that were in use at the time of the Magna Carta is impressive. Conversely, as you say, the vastness and diversity of both natural features and local cultures in the US could keep a traveler occupied for a lifetime.
              "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)

              Comment

              • phillygirl
                Not superior, just kind
                • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
                • 19840

                #8
                Originally posted by Celeste Chalfonte View Post

                HRH often quotes someone whose name I can't recall, "In the UK, 100 miles is a long way. In the US, 100 years is a long time." I'm not all that into England, but the fact that there are buildings in use to day that were in use at the time of the Magna Carta is impressive. Conversely, as you say, the vastness and diversity of both natural features and local cultures in the US could keep a traveler occupied for a lifetime.
                Exactly. Seeing how old things are in Europe is truly mind blowing for me. Just as seeing how vast the U.S. is has been mind blowing for many Europeans.
                I've only been to California once. It was for a long weekend and it was fairly limited (Orange County primarily). It was pretty. But it didn't blow me away. Having said that, I'm certain that there are a lot more places in California that I would probably really love.
                Not where I breathe, but where I love, I live...
                Robert Southwell, S.J.

                Comment

                • scott
                  Go-to Guru
                  • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                  • 15799

                  #9
                  Originally posted by phillygirl View Post

                  Exactly. Seeing how old things are in Europe is truly mind blowing for me. Just as seeing how vast the U.S. is has been mind blowing for many Europeans.
                  I've only been to California once. It was for a long weekend and it was fairly limited (Orange County primarily). It was pretty. But it didn't blow me away. Having said that, I'm certain that there are a lot more places in California that I would probably really love.
                  I promise you a sunset at Asilomar Beach near Celeste would blow you away.
                  "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
                  -John Locke

                  "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
                  -Newman

                  "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
                  -Newman

                  Comment

                  • Celeste Chalfonte
                    apostate
                    • Saturday, October 5, 2013
                    • 27897

                    #10
                    Originally posted by scott View Post

                    I promise you a sunset at Asilomar Beach near Celeste would blow you away.
                    Amend that to pretty much any beach around here.

                    beach monterey 11.26.21.jpg
                    "Since the historic ruling, the Lovings have become icons for equality. Mildred released a statement on the 40th anniversary of the ruling in 2007: 'I am proud that Richard’s and my name is on a court case that can help reinforce the love, the commitment, the fairness, and the family that so many people, Black or white, young or old, gay or straight, seek in life. I support the freedom to marry for all. That’s what Loving, and loving, are all about.'." - Mildred Loving (Loving v. Virginia)

                    Comment

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