Tomorrow Could Be the Beginning of the End for Net Neutrality. You Should Be Worried.

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  • Billy Jingo
    I shave with Occam's Razor
    • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
    • 18663

    #1

    Tomorrow Could Be the Beginning of the End for Net Neutrality. You Should Be Worried.

    Tomorrow Could Be the Beginning of the End for Net Neutrality. You Should Be Worried.


    Tomorrow is an important day for the future of the Internet. That's when the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) will cast a crucial vote that could send us down a dangerous and misguided path toward destroying the Internet as we know it. That path could end with an Internet of haves and have-nots, with big corporations deciding who falls into which camp, all based on the amount of money they pay. I'm urging the FCC to take a different course -- one that preserves the Internet as an open marketplace where everyone can continue to participate on equal footing, regardless of one's wealth or power.

    Tom Wheeler, the FCC's chairman, has a proposal that would undermine net neutrality, the principle that all Internet traffic must be treated equally. Net neutrality is embedded in the foundational architecture of the Internet, and it has served us well. Because of net neutrality, an email from my constituent in rural Minnesota gets to me as quickly as an email from my bank. Because of net neutrality, the website for the small neighborhood hardware store loads just as quickly as that of a major retail chain. Because of net neutrality, you were able to access this op-ed, even if your Internet provider doesn't like what I have to say.

    Net neutrality has made the Internet a platform for innovation and economic growth. For example, YouTube started as a relatively small outfit above a pizzeria in a strip mall. YouTube wanted to compete with Google, which had an online video product called Google Video (later Google Videos). Net neutrality guaranteed that YouTube's and Google's videos would travel to consumers at the same speeds. Google wasn't able to pay for a fast lane or any other unfair advantage. Even though Google was a bigger, wealthier, more established company, it had to compete with YouTube on a level playing field. And YouTube ultimately won because it offered a better product.

    That's what net neutrality is all about. There's not one Internet for deep-pocketed corporations and a separate Internet for everyone else -- there's the Internet, and it belongs to all of us. That's the way it's always been. And that's the way it should continue to be.

    But the FCC could change all of that by giving big Internet providers -- corporations like Comcast, Time Warner Cable, AT&T, and Verizon -- the power to pick and choose which traffic reaches consumers quickly--and which doesn't. The Chairman's plan would authorize pay-to-play arrangements. Here's how it would work: a big corporation would give the Internet providers extra money, and, in return, the Internet providers would give the corporations priority access on the Internet -- special treatment that wouldn't be available to those who can't afford to pay the gatekeeper. That's not net neutrality; it's greasing the bouncer.
    “One day, when it's safe, when there's no personal downside to calling a thing what it is, when it's too late to hold anyone accountable, everyone will have always been against this.”

    ~ Omar El Akkad
    ​
  • Billy Jingo
    I shave with Occam's Razor
    • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
    • 18663

    #2
    An alternate view on the issue.
    “One day, when it's safe, when there's no personal downside to calling a thing what it is, when it's too late to hold anyone accountable, everyone will have always been against this.”

    ~ Omar El Akkad
    ​

    Comment

    • scott
      Go-to Guru
      • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
      • 15799

      #3
      YouTube started as a relatively small outfit above a pizzeria in a strip mall. YouTube wanted to compete with Google, which had an online video product called Google Video (later Google Videos). Net neutrality guaranteed that YouTube's and Google's videos would travel to consumers at the same speeds. Google wasn't able to pay for a fast lane or any other unfair advantage. Even though Google was a bigger, wealthier, more established company, it had to compete with YouTube on a level playing field. And YouTube ultimately won because it offered a better product.
      Bullshit. Google won, it was just cheaper to buy Youtube than get rid of it. Here's a Star Trek reference, since technology really isn't his thing:

      When the Borg assimilates a person, that person did not beat the Borg.

      Youtube and other large providers certainly did have to pay for a "fast lane." Aside from direct agreements with ISPs, they built massive global content distribution networks to make the streaming videos work, and even built their own private fiber network which they use to swap with ISPs for data.





      "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
      -John Locke

      "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
      -Newman

      "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
      -Newman

      Comment

      • Norm dePlume
        Err foil
        • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
        • 14904

        #4
        The Borg never paid anyone $1.65 B for the privilege of assimilating them.

        And you're misconstruing the concept of a fast lane. At no time were YouTube's packets handled differently by ISP's than other packets.
        Enjoy.

        Comment

        • scott
          Go-to Guru
          • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
          • 15799

          #5
          Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
          The Borg never paid anyone $1.65 B for the privilege of assimilating them.

          And you're misconstruing the concept of a fast lane. At no time were YouTube's packets handled differently by ISP's than other packets.
          Assuming that's correct (it's not, IMO) it's a distinction without a difference. The big players can pay for better results and the little players get to compete through innovation. It's always been that way on the Internet.
          "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
          -John Locke

          "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
          -Newman

          "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
          -Newman

          Comment

          • RobJohnson
            Senior Member
            • Tuesday, April 22, 2014
            • 1393

            #6
            Originally posted by scott View Post
            Bullshit. Google won, it was just cheaper to buy Youtube than get rid of it. Here's a Star Trek reference, since technology really isn't his thing:

            When the Borg assimilates a person, that person did not beat the Borg.

            Youtube and other large providers certainly did have to pay for a "fast lane." Aside from direct agreements with ISPs, they built massive global content distribution networks to make the streaming videos work, and even built their own private fiber network which they use to swap with ISPs for data.





            http://www.businessinsider.com/paid-...plained-2014-2


            Nice job.


            Comment

            • Norm dePlume
              Err foil
              • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
              • 14904

              #7
              Originally posted by scott View Post
              Assuming that's correct (it's not, IMO) it's a distinction without a difference. The big players can pay for better results and the little players get to compete through innovation. It's always been that way on the Internet.
              You think that YouTube packets are treated differently by ISP's than CNN packets or Yahoo! packets or facebook packets?

              I've heard of one documented instance of an ISP throttling bittorrent traffic, but that was considered pretty unusual and the ISP denied doing it.
              Enjoy.

              Comment

              • scott
                Go-to Guru
                • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                • 15799

                #8
                Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                You think that YouTube packets are treated differently by ISP's than CNN packets or Yahoo! packets or facebook packets?
                On Comcast, Bright House, and Charter they are. They also are on several 3G and 4G networks, some of which are used in beach hotels. Netflix has higher priority on Verizon since their agreement (Netflix pays Comcast).

                Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                I've heard of one documented instance of an ISP throttling bittorrent traffic, but that was considered pretty unusual and the ISP denied doing it.
                There's more to this planet than just your own research.

                You can start here:



                Then more here:

                "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
                -John Locke

                "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
                -Newman

                "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
                -Newman

                Comment

                • Novaheart
                  Guardian of civilization
                  • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                  • 6070

                  #9
                  Originally posted by scott View Post
                  Bullshit. Google won, it was just cheaper to buy Youtube than get rid of it. Here's a Star Trek reference, since technology really isn't his thing:

                  When the Borg assimilates a person, that person did not beat the Borg.

                  Youtube and other large providers certainly did have to pay for a "fast lane." Aside from direct agreements with ISPs, they built massive global content distribution networks to make the streaming videos work, and even built their own private fiber network which they use to swap with ISPs for data.





                  http://www.businessinsider.com/paid-...plained-2014-2
                  Is that why major mainstream news sites take forever to load video but you tube is almost instant? I've been wondering about that, it seems unfathomable that MSNBC doesn't have the bandwidth or whatever to run their videos without a long load delay and stops and jerks…. but they suck. Fox, and ABC are no better. It reminds me of Sony, aka the crappiest corporate website in the world. You would think that SONY would have a slick website and perhaps they do now, but long after other people had functional user centered websites, SONY's website was crapp (scottish accent)
                  The year's at the spring
                  And day's at the morn;
                  Morning's at seven;
                  The hill-side's dew-pearled;
                  The lark's on the wing;
                  The snail's on the thorn:
                  God's in his heaven—
                  All's right with the world!

                  Comment

                  • Novaheart
                    Guardian of civilization
                    • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                    • 6070

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                    You think that YouTube packets are treated differently by ISP's than CNN packets or Yahoo! packets or facebook packets?

                    I've heard of one documented instance of an ISP throttling bittorrent traffic, but that was considered pretty unusual and the ISP denied doing it.
                    Go to Rachel Maddow and try to watch her video. Then go to You Tube and try to load "make up make over" or "world star hip hop". You Tube garbage loads faster and better than ABC, NBC, CBS, and Fox.
                    The year's at the spring
                    And day's at the morn;
                    Morning's at seven;
                    The hill-side's dew-pearled;
                    The lark's on the wing;
                    The snail's on the thorn:
                    God's in his heaven—
                    All's right with the world!

                    Comment

                    • Norm dePlume
                      Err foil
                      • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
                      • 14904

                      #11
                      Originally posted by scott View Post
                      On Comcast, Bright House, and Charter they are. They also are on several 3G and 4G networks, some of which are used in beach hotels. Netflix has higher priority on Verizon since their agreement (Netflix pays Comcast).



                      There's more to this planet than just your own research.

                      You can start here:



                      Then more here:

                      https://www.google.com/search?q=brig...ttling+youtube
                      Okay, there's rumor and innuendo.
                      Enjoy.

                      Comment

                      • Norm dePlume
                        Err foil
                        • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
                        • 14904

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Novaheart View Post
                        Go to Rachel Maddow and try to watch her video. Then go to You Tube and try to load "make up make over" or "world star hip hop". You Tube garbage loads faster and better than ABC, NBC, CBS, and Fox.
                        That's because their server serves it up faster, not because my ISP is manipulating my traffic.
                        Enjoy.

                        Comment

                        • scott
                          Go-to Guru
                          • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                          • 15799

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                          Okay, there's rumor and innuendo.
                          You just can't accept facts that disagree with your position.
                          "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
                          -John Locke

                          "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
                          -Newman

                          "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
                          -Newman

                          Comment

                          • Norm dePlume
                            Err foil
                            • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
                            • 14904

                            #14
                            Originally posted by scott View Post
                            You just can't accept facts that disagree with your position.
                            You know that Reddit thread has some people speculating that yes, they throttle YouTube and others doubting it and a Brighthouse technician saying that no, they definitely do not throttle any form of user traffic. The only thing definitive about it is what that says about your eagerness to believe.
                            Enjoy.

                            Comment

                            • scott
                              Go-to Guru
                              • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                              • 15799

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                              You know that Reddit thread has some people speculating that yes, they throttle YouTube and others doubting it and a Brighthouse technician saying that no, they definitely do not throttle any form of user traffic. The only thing definitive about it is what that says about your eagerness to believe.
                              You are simply looking for a reason to discount someone else's opinion.
                              "Faith is nothing but a firm assent of the mind : which, if it be regulated, as is our duty, cannot be afforded to anything but upon good reason, and so cannot be opposite to it."
                              -John Locke

                              "It's all been melded together into one giant, authoritarian, leftist scream."
                              -Newman

                              "Grievance groups are playing King of the Hill."
                              -Newman

                              Comment

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