Senate Republicans Seek To Delay Kavanaugh Vote Until Accuser Properly Smeared

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  • Billy Jingo
    I shave with Occam's Razor
    • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
    • 18663

    #46
    Originally posted by Adam View Post
    I'm reading through my copy of the Constitution and I can't seem to find the part where it says that the Senate has some particular time constraint upon them for providing Advice and Consent, nor where it says that they are obligated to act at all.
    So by not acting, they can eliminate the entire Judicial Branch of our government through attrition?

    I am on the fence with that one. I sort of lean toward agreeing with you and that the Senate can take down one full branch of our government merely through inaction. But you have to get past this very clear language:
    Article III

    Section 1

    The judicial power of the United States, shall be vested in one Supreme Court, …


    Also, there is this bit that can be seen as requiring the Senate act:
    Article II

    Section 2

    ... he shall nominate, and by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, shall appoint ... judges of the Supreme Court …

    The Link
    “One day, when it's safe, when there's no personal downside to calling a thing what it is, when it's too late to hold anyone accountable, everyone will have always been against this.”

    ~ Omar El Akkad
    ​

    Comment

    • Norm dePlume
      Err foil
      • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
      • 14904

      #47
      After some period of inaction, I figure the Senate has abdicated their advice and consent role. At some point, silence is consent.
      Enjoy.

      Comment

      • Billy Jingo
        I shave with Occam's Razor
        • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
        • 18663

        #48
        Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
        After some period of inaction, I figure the Senate has abdicated their advice and consent role. At some point, silence is consent.
        Isn't consent an affirmative act?
        “One day, when it's safe, when there's no personal downside to calling a thing what it is, when it's too late to hold anyone accountable, everyone will have always been against this.”

        ~ Omar El Akkad
        ​

        Comment

        • Adam
          The way to a woman's heart is through her taste buds.
          • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
          • 16885

          #49
          Originally posted by Djharkavy View Post
          If you went into the office and built paper clip chains all day, it's not illegal but you aren't doing your job.
          Perhaps I misunderstood what you were saying here:

          Originally posted by Djharkavy View Post
          Originally posted by Newman View Post
          The Democrats are under no Constitutional obligation to vote on Kavanaugh before the election.
          They can abstain, but they don't control when the vote will be.
          Since Newman was specifically referencing a Constitutional obligation, I took your response to mean that that the Senate ("they") has some Constitutional constraint upon the timing of a vote.

          Re-reading it, I can see how what you might have meant is that Democrats ("they") presently don't set the voting schedule since they are currently the minority party.
          It's been ten years since that lonely day I left you
          In the morning rain, smoking gun in hand
          Ten lonely years but how my heart, it still remembers
          Pray for me, momma, I'm a gypsy now

          Comment

          • Adam
            The way to a woman's heart is through her taste buds.
            • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
            • 16885

            #50
            Originally posted by Billy Jingo View Post
            So by not acting, they can eliminate the entire Judicial Branch of our government through attrition?

            I am on the fence with that one. I sort of lean toward agreeing with you and that the Senate can take down one full branch of our government merely through inaction. But you have to get past this very clear language:
            Article III

            Section 1

            The judicial power of the United States, shall be vested in one Supreme Court, …


            Also, there is this bit that can be seen as requiring the Senate act:
            Article II

            Section 2

            ... he shall nominate, and by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, shall appoint ... judges of the Supreme Court …

            The Link
            Neither of those "shalls" references the Senate, and I suspect that was on purpose. I think that the Founders probably intended abuse of this to be remedied through the erstwhile "ballot box" of state legislatures.

            I don't agree with the idea of the Senate just arbitrarily strangling the Judicial branch, but I think that they should have the ability to just refuse to act if they are presented with a nominee whom they find abhorrent or too divisive between them or whatever. Then again, the Supreme Court is clearly supposed to solely interpret the Constitution (on domestic matters) and not rely on outside decisions, but it has strayed widely from that mandate.
            It's been ten years since that lonely day I left you
            In the morning rain, smoking gun in hand
            Ten lonely years but how my heart, it still remembers
            Pray for me, momma, I'm a gypsy now

            Comment

            • Adam
              The way to a woman's heart is through her taste buds.
              • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
              • 16885

              #51
              Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
              After some period of inaction, I figure the Senate has abdicated their advice and consent role. At some point, silence is consent.
              Cool. So if Ford's accusation against Kavanaugh is 100% true, it turns out that she consented to this because he covered her mouth, rendering her silent.
              It's been ten years since that lonely day I left you
              In the morning rain, smoking gun in hand
              Ten lonely years but how my heart, it still remembers
              Pray for me, momma, I'm a gypsy now

              Comment

              • Norm dePlume
                Err foil
                • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
                • 14904

                #52
                Originally posted by Billy Jingo View Post
                Isn't consent an affirmative act?
                "Silence means consent" is a fairly common idiom. Maybe it's situational.
                Enjoy.

                Comment

                • Norm dePlume
                  Err foil
                  • Tuesday, October 22, 2013
                  • 14904

                  #53
                  Originally posted by Adam View Post
                  Cool. So if Ford's accusation against Kavanaugh is 100% true, it turns out that she consented to this because he covered her mouth, rendering her silent.
                  Well, maybe you interpret things that way, but I make a distinction between voluntary silence and forced silence. On a related note, I similarly distinguish contracts signed at gunpoint and confessions extracted under torture. Also, I figure this shouldn't need to be explicitly spelled out.
                  Enjoy.

                  Comment

                  • 80zephyr
                    Senior Member
                    • Saturday, January 3, 2015
                    • 19074

                    #54
                    [QUOTE=Adam;153293]Neither of those "shalls" references the Senate, and I suspect that was on purpose. I think that the Founders probably intended abuse of this to be remedied through the erstwhile "ballot box" of state legislatures.

                    I don't agree with the idea of the Senate just arbitrarily strangling the Judicial branch, but I think that they should have the ability to just refuse to act if they are presented with a nominee whom they find abhorrent or too divisive between them or whatever. Then again, the Supreme Court is clearly supposed to solely interpret the Constitution (on domestic matters) and not rely on outside decisions, but it has strayed widely from that mandate.[/QUOTE]

                    If they simply did their job instead of creating law, this wouldn't even be an issue.

                    Mark
                    Race Card: A tool of the intellectually weak and lazy when they cannot counter a logical argument or factual data.

                    "Liberals have to stop insisting that the world is what they want it to be instead of the way it is." - Bill Maher

                    Political correctness is ideological fascism. It’s the antithesis of freedom. Dr. Piper

                    Gender is not a "Social Construct", it is an outgrowth of biological reality.

                    Comment

                    • Newman
                      Behind the Iron Curtain
                      • Friday, November 1, 2013
                      • 25814

                      #55
                      Originally posted by Djharkavy View Post

                      Originally posted by Newman
                      The Democrats are under no Constitutional obligation to vote on Kavanaugh before the election.
                      They can abstain, but they don't control when the vote will be.
                      They're trying their best, through demands for new investigations re Ms Ford's Bad Date. The Parties are jousting in the court of public opinion (present and predicted) for control. It's a bit misleading to suggest the Democrats are idle bystanders in setting the date for action.

                      Originally posted by Djharkavy View Post
                      And as a result, the Court did not have its full complement for a term. The Senate, for partisan reasons, did not do their job.
                      There is no obligation under the Constitution to have nine, or any particular number of Justices.

                      Originally posted by Djharkavy View Post
                      If you went into the office and built paper clip chains all day, it's not illegal but you aren't doing your job.
                      Stalling, slow-walking, #Resisting, treachery, etc. and whatever—these are ALL fire-able offenses. Impeachment is theoretically available, and ordinary criminal statutes apply (cf. William Jefferson of tin foil-wrapped money in the freezer infame), but the true boss is the voting constituent. Simply disagreeing with voting constituents is a fire-able offense. And if enough of those voting constituents agree with Djharkavy, the congress critter will be fired.
                      • "I'm a hell of a lot smarter than most of you guys." — Joe Biden, at Jesse Jackson's funeral, March 2026.​
                      • "That's all I do in my life. I make deals. I'm really good at it." — President Donald Trump, Oct. 13, 2025.
                      • “Inside every progressive is a totalitarian screaming to get out,” — David Horowitz.
                      • "We [Democrats] are all willing to work with anyone who is serious about doing the work of censoring the American people, and advancing progress."​ — Ayanna Pressley, explaining progressives.
                      • ​​"Florida is where Woke goes to die." — Ron DeSantis.
                      • "No one is above the law, and everyone has the right to a trial to prove innocence." — Nancy Pelosi, explaining Lawfare.
                      • “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”​— Ben Franklin, who got it right.
                      • "The way I see it, there's always, c'mon, there's always money. It's there." — Elizabeth Warren, explaining socialism.
                      • "The interesting thing about the Green New Deal is it wasn't originally a climate thing at all.... We really think of it as a how-do-you-change-the-entire-economy thing." — Saikat Chakrabarti, then AOC's Chief of Staff.

                      Comment

                      • Newman
                        Behind the Iron Curtain
                        • Friday, November 1, 2013
                        • 25814

                        #56
                        Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                        After some period of inaction, I figure the Senate has abdicated their advice and consent role. At some point, silence is consent.
                        Originally posted by Norm dePlume View Post
                        "Silence means consent" is a fairly common idiom. Maybe it's situational.
                        Silence is golden, but not always consent. Certainly not in cases of sexual assault, and certainly not when the language specifies that the Senate must give advice and consent. There is no "deeming" in this.
                        • "I'm a hell of a lot smarter than most of you guys." — Joe Biden, at Jesse Jackson's funeral, March 2026.​
                        • "That's all I do in my life. I make deals. I'm really good at it." — President Donald Trump, Oct. 13, 2025.
                        • “Inside every progressive is a totalitarian screaming to get out,” — David Horowitz.
                        • "We [Democrats] are all willing to work with anyone who is serious about doing the work of censoring the American people, and advancing progress."​ — Ayanna Pressley, explaining progressives.
                        • ​​"Florida is where Woke goes to die." — Ron DeSantis.
                        • "No one is above the law, and everyone has the right to a trial to prove innocence." — Nancy Pelosi, explaining Lawfare.
                        • “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”​— Ben Franklin, who got it right.
                        • "The way I see it, there's always, c'mon, there's always money. It's there." — Elizabeth Warren, explaining socialism.
                        • "The interesting thing about the Green New Deal is it wasn't originally a climate thing at all.... We really think of it as a how-do-you-change-the-entire-economy thing." — Saikat Chakrabarti, then AOC's Chief of Staff.

                        Comment

                        • Billy Jingo
                          I shave with Occam's Razor
                          • Wednesday, October 2, 2013
                          • 18663

                          #57
                          Originally posted by Newman View Post
                          Silence is golden, but not always consent. Certainly not in cases of sexual assault, and certainly not when the language specifies that the Senate must give advice and consent. There is no "deeming" in this.
                          "[G]ive" is not in the text.

                          It does not indicate in any way how "by and with" is measured or defined.
                          “One day, when it's safe, when there's no personal downside to calling a thing what it is, when it's too late to hold anyone accountable, everyone will have always been against this.”

                          ~ Omar El Akkad
                          ​

                          Comment

                          • Newman
                            Behind the Iron Curtain
                            • Friday, November 1, 2013
                            • 25814

                            #58
                            Originally posted by Billy Jingo View Post
                            "[G]ive" is not in the text.

                            It does not indicate in any way how "by and with" is measured or defined.
                            You're right.

                            Let me know when the first president tries to take silence as consent in confirming its nominees.



                            We've had enough trouble with recess appointments....
                            • "I'm a hell of a lot smarter than most of you guys." — Joe Biden, at Jesse Jackson's funeral, March 2026.​
                            • "That's all I do in my life. I make deals. I'm really good at it." — President Donald Trump, Oct. 13, 2025.
                            • “Inside every progressive is a totalitarian screaming to get out,” — David Horowitz.
                            • "We [Democrats] are all willing to work with anyone who is serious about doing the work of censoring the American people, and advancing progress."​ — Ayanna Pressley, explaining progressives.
                            • ​​"Florida is where Woke goes to die." — Ron DeSantis.
                            • "No one is above the law, and everyone has the right to a trial to prove innocence." — Nancy Pelosi, explaining Lawfare.
                            • “Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”​— Ben Franklin, who got it right.
                            • "The way I see it, there's always, c'mon, there's always money. It's there." — Elizabeth Warren, explaining socialism.
                            • "The interesting thing about the Green New Deal is it wasn't originally a climate thing at all.... We really think of it as a how-do-you-change-the-entire-economy thing." — Saikat Chakrabarti, then AOC's Chief of Staff.

                            Comment

                            • Novaheart
                              Guardian of civilization
                              • Tuesday, October 1, 2013
                              • 6070

                              #59
                              Originally posted by Djharkavy View Post
                              I dislike both. I prefer days when the difference between parties could result in compromise legislation.

                              But I see the difference between voting against something and refusing to even debate it.

                              Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk
                              There is no compromise on The Bill Of Rights. You either support Freedom of Speech or you don't. Democrats are the ones most sympathetic to restrictions on speech. Democrats are hostile to the Right To Assemble. Democrats are contemptuous of the SRight to Keep and Bear Arms. This makes it difficult but not impossible to side with folks with whom you might not normally choose to associate.
                              The year's at the spring
                              And day's at the morn;
                              Morning's at seven;
                              The hill-side's dew-pearled;
                              The lark's on the wing;
                              The snail's on the thorn:
                              God's in his heaven—
                              All's right with the world!

                              Comment

                              • Djharkavy
                                Senior Member
                                • Saturday, October 31, 2015
                                • 4286

                                #60
                                Originally posted by Novaheart View Post
                                There is no compromise on The Bill Of Rights. You either support Freedom of Speech or you don't. Democrats are the ones most sympathetic to restrictions on speech. Democrats are hostile to the Right To Assemble. Democrats are contemptuous of the SRight to Keep and Bear Arms. This makes it difficult but not impossible to side with folks with whom you might not normally choose to associate.
                                How is that relevant?

                                Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk

                                Comment

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